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Zazou
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Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 7:36 pm   

[2.33] Mapper and interface bugs
 
Hi all,

I've been using the CMUD trial a couple of days now, and encountered some bugs which are really affecting usability. It's a huge shame, since CMUD is generally so much better than ZMUD!

#1: MXP gauges are created regardless of preference settings.

I took unchecking the "automatic gauges" in preferences to mean that they would no longer be created fpr hp/sp/st upon login, but no. CMUD creates new gauges at each login regardless of whether they exist already, resulting in the wretched things accumulating and needing removal. With this option unchecked, should they be created at all?

#2: While docked, the scrollwheel does not function in the mapper.

If the mapper is docked on the screen rather than left in its own window, the scrollwheel operates for the main MUD window rather than the mapper, even when the mapper has focus. This makes the mapper almost unusable for me, since I can't navigate around a map quickly using the wheel for zoom or pan/scan.

#3: Not so much a bug, but has the option to not underline MXP links been removed? I can't for the life of me find it.

I've had some other bugs show up, but they've been quite haphazard. I'll report them once I can actually reproduce them. :>

Zazou
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MattLofton
GURU


Joined: 23 Dec 2000
Posts: 4834
Location: USA

PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:41 pm   
 
#2. Zugg is currently in the process of converting the mapper from ADO to SQLite format, and he will be fixing some of the mapper issues. Prior to now (that is, this next beta cycle that Zugg hasn't released anything for yet), the mapper is line for line the same thing as is found in ZMud and isn't very CMud compatible. He'll be mapping it up in two or three phases, with the last phase taking the mapper concept light years ahead of anything out on the market today. Again!

#3. One of the things Zugg did with CMud was clean up the preferences pages. Several of the items that show up in ZMud still exist in CMud, but are now swept off the Preferences and accessible via the %pref() function. I haven't had to use it for anything just yet, so I couldn't tell you anything about it.
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Zazou
Beginner


Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 9:57 pm   
 
Hi, thanks for the reply.

For #2, even if there are a lot of changes coming up for the mapper, one would hope that it would currently be bug-free in CMUD, since it /is/ a commercial product now, not just a beta.

And with #3... "cleaning up" the preference page is a strongly negative thing when it reduces useful functionality. :p There is an option in %pref() for "MXPUnderline". I've set it to 0, but it made no difference.
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Zazou
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Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:21 pm   
 
Bugs:

#4: It's impossible (or at least far more difficult) to select a *link* rather than a *room* in the map editor, while this was easy in zmud. Obviously this makes toggling a link to a door much more laborious.

#5: If I've loaded the mapper from one window (call it Zazou), it's seemingly impossible to have it associate to a different connection.

#6: My layout is refusing to save, so I keep having to recreate it each time. I'm more than happy to provide more info to debug this, such as my layout file.

#7: The layout system itself seems to have some severe problems. A moment ago when I dragged the mapper out of its place (docked), it left a space there with the mapper title and such, and popped the mapper up in its own box, but unresponsive. After a little bit of fiddling around, trying to get this to work, well, my computer crashed. I have no idea how to recreate this, though!

I've also had problems with the MUD prompt sometimes loading in a bugged way, and flickering, while CMUD itself is unresponsive. Is this a known bug?
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Zazou
Beginner


Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Sun Jul 27, 2008 11:31 pm   
 
Just a note:

Apologies for the brief explanations; it's mostly because I don't know whether things I'm mentioning are known or unknown bugs, or even things which have already been fixed.

I'm more than happy to provide as much help as I can in fixing them, though.

Zazou
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MattLofton
GURU


Joined: 23 Dec 2000
Posts: 4834
Location: USA

PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 3:04 am   
 
#2. It's only been debugged enough so that old zmud code doesn't crash new CMud code.

#4. Identical to the way it works in ZMud

#5. The mapper is unable to work with multiple sessions. This is basically how it worked in ZMud, too, but the new docking system exposed even more problems with this so the problem's a little worse in CMud.
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Zugg
MASTER


Joined: 25 Sep 2000
Posts: 23379
Location: Colorado, USA

PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 4:45 pm   
 
#3: The Underline MXP option was replaced by a new "Style" that controls how MXP links are displayed. Go into the Styles Preference page and selec the URL Style and you can control how links look. This allows you to give URL links a color, make them underlined, bold, italic, or whatever you want.

#6,7: Hold down the SHIFT key and click the Open Offline option for your session to reset the layout to the default. Then you can adjust the layout and it should start saving again. It sounds like your layout file has gotten corrupted somehow.
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Zugg
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Joined: 25 Sep 2000
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Location: Colorado, USA

PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 5:19 pm   
 
#1: I cannot reproduce this. When a MUD creates a gauge, that gauge is stored in your session preferences. So when you load your session in the future, the gauge will still be there even if the MUD doesn't recreate it. If the MUD sends another command to create the gauge, CMUD overwrites the definition of the previous gauge with the same name. So you shouldn't be able to get multiple duplicate gauges unless the MUD isn't sending the gauge command correctly.

If the MXP Gauge option is disabled, that *does* block the command sent from the MUD to create the gauge. But it doesn't prevent any gauges that were previously saved with your session from still being displayed. You need to manually delete those gauges if you don't want them.

MXP Gauges are created within the System/MXP class folder, so be sure you haven't moved them to some other folder or else they might get recreated.
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Dumas
Enchanter


Joined: 11 Feb 2003
Posts: 511
Location: USA

PostPosted: Mon Jul 28, 2008 8:54 pm   
 
Zazou wrote:

For #2, even if there are a lot of changes coming up for the mapper, one would hope that it would currently be bug-free in CMUD, since it /is/ a commercial product now, not just a beta.


Actually, if you go back and read the original information about CMUD, Zugg specifically stated that the mapper would not be worked on as it was (as well as the old database system). He has not changed that position. The updated mapper is a new mapper based off the old one and off zMapper. He has, however, worked to take care of any major bugs that creep up in the mapper with CMUD. Some of the non-fatal bugs (for example the issue with selecting individual links) are not game killers and as such will not get much attention as it will go away with the new one.

Think of it this way, if you had Windows Vista, but still were using IE 4, you should expect things wouldn't work exactly as you would like as Vista wasn't really designed to run it. It will, there just won't be any support for any issues.
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Zazou
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Joined: 19 Feb 2007
Posts: 13

PostPosted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 2:15 am   
 
Zugg wrote:
#1: I cannot reproduce this. When a MUD creates a gauge, that gauge is stored in your session preferences. So when you load your session in the future, the gauge will still be there even if the MUD doesn't recreate it. If the MUD sends another command to create the gauge, CMUD overwrites the definition of the previous gauge with the same name. So you shouldn't be able to get multiple duplicate gauges unless the MUD isn't sending the gauge command correctly.

If the MXP Gauge option is disabled, that *does* block the command sent from the MUD to create the gauge. But it doesn't prevent any gauges that were previously saved with your session from still being displayed. You need to manually delete those gauges if you don't want them.

MXP Gauges are created within the System/MXP class folder, so be sure you haven't moved them to some other folder or else they might get recreated.


Thanks very much for the reply! I'll do some investigating to try to figure out exactly what creates this problem. It doesn't seem to be always when I log on to the MUD. And no, the issue is that I have a few gauges that I want which integrate into a script, and some other ones keep cropping up. :>

Turning off underline for URLs worked fine, though I'm not so sure many users would classify MXP links as URLs. It might be nice to have a separate style for MXP links?

I've tried deleting my layout and recreating already, but I'll try your method and see if it works. Thanks again!

A quick question about the new mapper format: will it be largely compatible in its storage with the current one? I mean, obviously the database *format* will change, but will the structure of tables and such remain the same? I have a Javascript application for a fan site which uses data straight from the mapper to give most of the mapper's read-only features for users, and I'm curious how much work will be involved in changing it. :)

Dumas wrote:
Zazou wrote:

For #2, even if there are a lot of changes coming up for the mapper, one would hope that it would currently be bug-free in CMUD, since it /is/ a commercial product now, not just a beta.


Actually, if you go back and read the original information about CMUD, Zugg specifically stated that the mapper would not be worked on as it was (as well as the old database system). He has not changed that position. The updated mapper is a new mapper based off the old one and off zMapper. He has, however, worked to take care of any major bugs that creep up in the mapper with CMUD. Some of the non-fatal bugs (for example the issue with selecting individual links) are not game killers and as such will not get much attention as it will go away with the new one.

Think of it this way, if you had Windows Vista, but still were using IE 4, you should expect things wouldn't work exactly as you would like as Vista wasn't really designed to run it. It will, there just won't be any support for any issues.


Thanks for the explanation, though your analogy is fallacious. Vista does not come with IE4, IE4 is not integrated into Vista, and IE4 support is not advertised for Vista. :p That said, I can't wait for the new mapper!

Zazou
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Zugg
MASTER


Joined: 25 Sep 2000
Posts: 23379
Location: Colorado, USA

PostPosted: Tue Jul 29, 2008 8:40 pm   
 
Quote:
A quick question about the new mapper format: will it be largely compatible in its storage with the current one?

Currently I am keeping the structure of Tables and Fields intact for compatibility. I thought about starting from scratch on this, but that last time I did that (with zMapper) it took me over a year to get a mapper that was compatible with the previous versions. And I didn't want to do that this time. So this isn't a rewrite from scratch...it's a conversion of the existing mapper code.

The first phase just replaces the ADO/MDAC engine with the ZeosLib database library (using SQLite for the default database protocol). As *new* features are added to the mapper later (like to support tile-based maps), then additional fields and/or tables may be added. But CMUD will be able to convert any existing map file into any new table format that is required.

So while I can't guarantee that I won't make changes to the database structure in the future, I'm not planning on any structure changes during this first conversion phase.
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